What is a Cheap Watch?
In the pursuit of stocking my eclectic watch collections I keep trying to categorize the watch universe and figure out where I place myself in it. Why do I collect the watches that I collect? Also, because our society is so politically charged now, I wonder where watches line up with income lines. Seems everything we do nowadays is a political statement? Do people move upward or even downward to get watches? Wow. On top of that I also think about technology changes and the environmental impact of watches! I always tell people I collect cheap watches, but I don’t really know what that means? In the end, watches are just fun.
Timex, Timex, Timex…
I read so many different watch blogs and articles on a daily basis(via blog/websites on a laptop, rather than social media apps) I am confronted with just about every watch category and opinion out there, at one time or another. Timex watches are what pulled me deep into the watch universe even though I owned other brands before I got involved with Timex. The stereotypical gateway watches for me must have been my Timex Archive collection, but I could also say it might have been a type of watch, military inspired tool or fashion watches, rather than a brand, that pulled me in. Timex designs have a lot of design considerations—the visual, the theme. They are about the feelings they evoke more than they are about the quality of their material content. While an Omega might be beautiful sculpture of metal and finish and applied counters and amazing mechanics, a Timex will be almost a two-dimensional graphic representation of a watch, with printed dial, and minimal quartz (or automatic) movement, but still a 3-d object. The Omega packs the most possible quality and quantity into the space while the Timex uses the least possible quality and quantity to convey a feeling. They get the most with the least. They are brilliant, really.
I don’t get as many Timex watches now. Mainly because I am getting saturated and know the perils of rescue/repair, but also because more recent Timex products have not interested me. I just don’t like a lot of their newer stuff, even the reissues! As I get exposed to other brands and learn more about watches in general I try other things. Mostly design/style is the lure. It could be the history/back story, quality, technology, or I must admit, the potential value. What ever it is, it is usually balanced by the initial cost, and more recently the the repair cost estimate!
Design
Product design in general is also something that draws me to watches. Watches are a personal interface with technology. They are like automobiles to us, but on a smaller scale. Little structures or sculptures on our wrist. We often impose a lot of our identity on the cars we choose. We do the same for watches. The good thing about watches is we can have twenty watches easier than we can twenty automobiles. Well, maybe not if you are in the top tier luxury watch realm where cost is not an issue. Even if you are a tier down, say in the upper 9.9 percent, your watches may cost the same as a standard automobile of the next tier below. We all spend in our individual ways. But, I digress. Mostly, wherever you stand, cost is part of the equation, but, there are lots of other things we attach to watches. They are symbols, statements and represent lots of our interests. They take us somewhere.
Cheap?
I have chosen to collect cheap watches. Why? I’m not sure. Mainly the cost thing, and the fact that I can have ten watches for $100 each instead of one watch for $1000. Price seems to be the main delineator in the hierarchy of the watch world, more so than other attributes. Micro brands are changing that some, I think. But again we each, individually apply value to certain things in different ways. We each have individual priorities. I could choose to have fewer, more costly watches, but, even then, I don’t think the price would go up to more than $1500-2500 a watch on occasion? (right, that’s what everyone says until they are swimming in cash). Its easy for me to say that since I can’t afford luxury watches at going rates. If I did have the money to buy APs, Rolexs, or Langes, I’m not sure I would, really. I have no desire to own a Rolex. Too much hype. I would feel like I am getting above my raisin. It would not be as much fun? But what is a cheap watch? Its a relative thing for each person’s spending ceiling. To me that is usually under $300, certainly under $500. Most of my watches are in the $50-150 range. Many in the $10-30 range! With repairs, most under $250.
Cheap can also mean expendable to some. At whatever cost, it is a watch you are not afraid to beat up a little, or a lot. You see, this is again different for everyone and a particular watch. One person’s cheap is another’s grail. Someone might get something like an AP Offshore and wear it everyday, for every chore or occasion, for ten years and thrash it. Then another person would get the same watch and only wear it for the occasional party or outing once every couple of months and plan to sell it in a few years for a profit. Another might get a Timex and do the same; wear it everyday for every occasion for five years (if it can last!) and not consider it a cheap watch, but just a normal watch.
So, I guess to me a cheap watch is a watch that came to me easily, cheaply price-wise, without a lot of planning, scheming, and saving. Well, maybe some scheming. It can also be something you are not worried about its value/resale potential, or something that will be attractive to thieves. I like the thrill of the bargain hunt. eBay, estate sale, Goodwill, family off-load, etc. A cheap watch is also something people can treat badly, or not baby, again, relative. Contradicting some previous statements, I baby many of my cheap watches! I know the ones that can be tool-ish apart from the ones that are more fashion, or tool poseurs. Not so much for the possible resale value, but because I know they cannot be fixed or repaired or replaced, in many cases.
Low-caliber Enthusiasm
Basically I am a watch keeper, not a watch flipper. I need to be a watch seller, as most collectors know! There is a limit… How many watches can a collector have? Generally the more they cost, the fewer you have. Still, at any price point, there is a limit of controlled enjoyment? I tend to shun the well-known watches or trends. I do, however, occasionally buy a new watch. Inexpensive, of course. New watches cost too much. I love to read about all kinds of watches, but it irritates me some about how much media coverage in the watch community covers luxury watches and high end luxury at that? There can’t be that many people buying them? It also appears that the high-end mechanical watch market is struggling, too? The largest watch segment must be the low-end? I suppose its like cars; lots of ink and digits go into coverage of luxury cars that few really buy. For most of the watches I buy, it is hard to find any information or stories at all other than generic press releases.
While I am rambling on, what is a watch enthusiast? There seems to be a price point attached to that, too? Is it possible to be an enthusiast for watches costing under $300, $100? I hate talking about price so much, but it is a main issue in watch media and watch collecting. People love to talk about watches they can’t afford to own. People don’t talk so much about the watches they do own, unless they are expensive. Due to social media pressure, people also buy watches they can’t afford to own and quickly resell them to get another watch they can’t afford for long. There seems to be a disproportionate amount of information available on watches few can buy to the information on watches most people do buy? Micro brands are giving people an escape valve to more performance at lower prices. Where are the stories about actors or other celebrities and their Timex or Seiko 5 collections? That would be a great read.
People’s Watch
If the middle class is shrinking and the biggest watch segment is the low-end segment, why is watch enthusiasm focused on luxury watches? Why am I mostly reading about watches costing $1,000-5,000, or more? What do watch buyers in the $100 to $500 really aspire to own? To be fair, all the major watch blogs do cover Seiko, Casio, Citizen and lots of micro brands that do sell watches under $1,000, at least for new releases. However, most time is spent on watches most people will not own. It is understandable because that is were the money is to be made by all concerned. There seems to be little follow-up, history, markets and coverage of collectors of low-end watches.
To be fair, maybe I’m reading the wrong blogs and have misplaced expectations. There are people covering low-end watches. The common watch is probably not interesting but there is exclusivity in cheap watches, too, and interesting stories, I’m sure? Why do resurrected watch companies that once sold people’s watches return only to move up into higher priced segments? It seems every watch brand, all the way down to Timex wants to move up the food chain selling ever more costly watches. Sell fewer watches at higher prices, preferably limited editions.
I can mention a positive development: Recently Hodinkee announced it has decided to get out of selling watches so much and get back to providing fun watch content! More interesting stories about watches in general.
Fashion/Style
Style I think is the most important quality of a watch for me? When I look at a watch it is the design, the style, the emotion it provokes rather than the brand or value or even technology. Timex lets me enjoy a lot of watches. The expression of something that I identify with? It should tell time reasonably accurately, too. I change watches often. When at home, I change watches for different activities or even just for the fun of it. I can’t imagine wearing one watch all day, for years! A watch is also fashion statement no matter what anyone may say otherwise. It there are two watches with the same functional specs but in different colors, you make a fashion choice when you pick one over the other. Even if they have different specs and looks, choosing one is also sometimes a fashion statement.
A shape, a contour, a typeface, a color palette, a texture, a finish, a personality, a function; any one of these or combination of them will hit you when you first see a watch. It will place that watch in one of your personal watch categories. You may not be able to determine, without careful consideration, why it captured you. It will take you to a place you like to be.
I have the luxury of time, space and enough spending money and a retired lifestyle to dedicate myself to multiple watches. I did not thirty years ago with small children and jobs. Things change in your life over time and you tastes and watch expressions change, too. For example, as I have written in earlier posts, I would not have bought some watches I own in the 1990s at the time, but like them now.
Some days you like tool watches, some days vintage watches, sometimes a dress watch or a chronograph. Some days any watch will do as long as its interesting. The more I know about watches, the more accepting I am of different expressions of what a watch can be. At the low end some quality can seem almost criminal and at the luxury end there can be too much excess. Even though I have a lot of different watches, there is still a few common themes. You could say my range is conservative. In the wide world of watches, there is still a lot of things I don’t like. For example, I don’t like skeleton designs. I have very few digital watches and I am uncomfortable with the idea of smart watches. I think we are too connected to info tech as it is now. I want nothing to do with an Apple watch but use other Apple phones and laptops. I have room for quartz, solar, manual wind mechanical and automatics. I’m interested in what’s inside, but mostly care about the outside design. As fascinating as mechanical watches are, there is that aspect of them being outdated and unnecessary. Nevertheless, I still need the spatial changes of hands or counters moving on a dial that analog watches provide.
More on watch repair
I rescue watches that others discard. I spend considerable time and money getting knackered watches refurbished. Why? I guess I just can’t stand to see nice designs die and I like the idea of old things surviving. Quartz or mechanical is a big topic in relation to repair and environmental protection. I recently read an article on Hodinkee about the Swatch System 51 and how it compares to other mechanical and quartz moments in relation to environmental impact. “SISTEM51 is designed to work seven to eight years at minimum, up to 10 years maintenance-free.”
It made me consider, again, what are the differences between manufacturing a quartz watch and a mechanical watch when you total up all the factors of sourcing materials, energy used for parts, logistics, distribution, human employment, and repair and maintenance. Should we repair or replace? What can be reused and recycled? Did Timex have it right in the 1950s and 1960s with watches that were not really meant to be repaired? They just never considered the recycle part of the equation. The enclosed System 51 movement is not really meant to be repaired either. Nothing lasts forever. What is the useful life of any watch? How long should something be repaired? There is no one answer, I guess? Is it just me, or am I seeing more watch brands offering more quartz options again?
Mechanical watches are traditionally valued because they have movements that can be repaired. But repair entails making spare parts that might not ever be used. How many to make, store, and transport? How much waste? In theory, a mechanical watch, if maintained and repaired can outlive a quartz watch’s 20-30 year lifespan, but at what cost? There aren’t enough watchmakers now to repair any kind of watch. Most people don’t get any watch fixed; they sell them at the first sign of trouble. Companies are loathe to make anything that is not going to be sold quickly. Seems most of the watch market now is comprised of Limited Editions because no manufacturer wants to make any more than necessary and it also maintains exclusivity demand. Can just-in-time repair parts be made only as needed? How long can a technology be supported? Its been a problem as long a mankind first tied two sticks together.
Now that we are running out of room, reducing waste means not making as much in the first place then reusing/recycling as much as possible. But, there always has to be something new to keep selling watches. What are the issues with quartz watch repair/recycle/reuse? What about digital and smart watches? Do quartz movements entail less waste in the big picture? Now that we are 40-50 years past the introduction of the quartz watch, we have seen a movement back to the mechanical watch at ever increasing price points. The cheap watches that I collect are mostly aging quartz watches from the 90s and early 2000s that have issues and are not in vogue. My first thought on reuse/recycle is to expand production of old standard quartz movements with updates/improvements; keep old watches going longer. That also means smaller sales of new watches. Why not more standardized/universal quartz movement systems designed to fit any watch? But, that’s just the movements. What about the cases, bracelets, crowns, dials and hands!? Well, watch companies are doing a lot of reissues anyway!
Timex Repair
Oh, about that…I have written before about my trials is getting cheap quartz watches repaired. It makes me ask the question, What was the expected lifespan of a quartz movement in 1980 or 1990 or 2024? How long did any watch company really want their watches to keep running? Timex watches are generally inexpensive and the quality is low in many respects, so you get what you pay for. I see a lot of reports of quality control problems on various watch forums or YouTube reviews. But overall, I love them and they fill a market niche.
I have come to the conclusion, after a few years of intense Timex collecting, that Timex struggles to repair watches and really doesn’t want to. They want to sell new watches. For starters, they have a one-year warranty, when bought from an AD. There are not many Timex ADs that are not online and Timex really wants to sell direct anyway. They make so many different kinds of watches, so fast that they can’t even keep up with advertising or marketing them. How in hell are they going to be able to maintain parts for all of them? I have had them tell me they do not have replacement movements/parts for watches only a few years old. But then, sometimes they can fix 15 year-old ones? If they can fix a watch out of warranty, it only costs $30, and they do a great job. But lately, its a mess.
I buy lots of preowned Timex watches. Many have, er… issues; that’s why they being sold. Owners don’t want the hassle and cost of getting something repaired that really has a weak support system. Most watchmakers don’t like to work on them. Of course, Timex wants to replace movements or watches, not repair them. I don’t know what their calculation is, but the first response is to send a replacement same watch if available. Second choice is to give you something similar. You could say that most Timex watches are still, not really expected to be repaired. Timex doesn’t even like to divulge what kinds of movements are in their watches. What does that tell you?
My current nightmare is a watch I sent to Timex in Nov-Dec of 2023. Paid for repair in Jan 2024. Still not resolved. A cool, vintage- styled Weekender, TW2P85800, made in 2016. It needed a crown. It is now August 2024 and I still have not received the watch. The way the system normally works is you submit an online repair request, ship to Indiana. A PayPal invoice come to you a month or so later. You pay it and a watch arrives from the Philippines another month or so later.
Missing watch, materializes? Image Timex
The system has collapsed into a terrible confused mess; After multiple emails and phone calls over the last eight months the current status is the watch was mailed in March 2024 to a wrong address. I don’t believe that, but its possible? I think it was just lost in the system or sent to Rewound. Now they want to replace it. I’m pretty sure they will not find another TW2P85800 available so will try to give me something else. I’m waiting for a response which will probably not happen unless I contact them again. Update: At this point it has been 16 days since customer service said they will get back to me on replacement options…Hold the press: finally Timex got back to me in about three weeks to offer as replacement generic, leftover Weekender or Expedition models that nobody really wants. I declined and asked for my $30 back.
Hold the press, again: on 9 Sep 2024, with no notice from Timex customer service, a TW2P85800 shows up via Fedex!? It came from the Philippines in four days. It is not the watch I sent in, but it is great to get the same style watch back. It has a different case back with different date stamp and came with an appropriate brown NATO leather strap. I sent the watch to Timex without the strap it came on, as they request, but it came back with another brown strap. It is interesting, too, that they created the model number sticker on the back by cutting two different stickers to get TW2P85/800. After nine months and a lot of effort on my part, Timex did come through and deliver me a watch like the one I sent in, with a crown! So they found one or built one from parts and gave me another strap.
I think there has been massive reorganizations at Timex over the past couple of years which has impacted their repair system and customer service. But you would not hear about that because none of the watch media really covers events involving Timex other than their latest collab. If by chance anybody reads this, let me know of any successful Timex repair operations you know of.
Timex is also feeling the pressure of environmental impacts of their operations. They are trickling in recycled materials with their watches and have established Timex Rewound with which they repair and resell any brand watch fixable that is submitted. If not easily repairable, it is recycled. This program keeps many watches out of the trash. If you send in a watch, Timex covers postage and you receive a discount coupon on a new watch purchase as well a knowing you did a little bit to reduce waste.
Realistically, no watch company wants to repair 30 year-old quartz watches, or even automatics. Yes, luxury brands will keep them going. There is money in keeping your Patek ticking. They want to sell you new stuff. It is just not good business to put too much into the logistics of repair. Mid to low-end segment customers really don’t want to pay for repairs anyway. Besides money, there is considerable time and effort needed to repair watches. You really have to want it. Have current global warming conditions caused us to rethink reuse? That’s why specialty independent watchmakers have to take up the business.
We all learn through experience. I have taken a 12 year-old Breitling to an AD, a large retail jewelry chain, that has watchmakers. They determined it was necessary to forward it to Breitling for overhaul; $600 and six months. Many people who can afford to buy the Breitling at retail price, don’t want to go through that. Naively, I have taken to that same AD, a 25 year-old Bulova quartz, a 35 year-old Tag Heuer quartz and a 46 year-old Tissot auto. Similarly, in-house watchmakers did/could not want to do the work; all were forwarded to the Brands (sometimes at my expense) only to be returned to AD because they too do not have parts or want to find the parts to repair. But, they do send a coupon for discount on new watch.
After these experiences I realized I had more luck with Timex! I have had several good experiences with Timex in the past. Now I know to go direct to independent specialized watchmakers. The first question that comes to me now is, “Why did the AD watchmakers send multiple watches forward to multiple manufacturers without knowing that they would almost certainly not fix them?!” I can understand the store sales staff not knowing this, but the watchmakers? That tells me the AD staff and watchmakers don’t have much experience with older watches. Which further confirms that most people don’t get watches repaired as much as they do off-load them.
Time to move on. I’ll be back with more post on Timex and other brands as I pursue my watch obsession.
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